Pat Metheny : American Garage

SUBJECT:	“Goodbye” Back to Subjects
jcoyle231 Mar 04 2020 at 11:30 AM	“Goodbye”, from the ‘Travels’ recording is one of my 10 favorite PMG tunes and I was wondering if it was ever played live after that tour. I never heard it at the many shows I attended over the years. Pat’s solo is one of his best, in my opinion. Knocks me out. Told my kids already to play it at my way-in-the-future memorial service. Any thoughts? Thanks.
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jcoyle231 Jun 11 2020 at 12:54 PM	Thanks, Michel. Have listened to other live versions of “Goodbye”, but the ‘Travels’ version is by far the best in my opinion, just as AYGWM on the same record is the best I’ve heard.
michelforest Jun 04 2020 at 10:50 PM	"Goodbye" was played around 1985-86, I have a few live recordings of it with Pedro Aznar and one with David Blamires on vocals.
facing west May 10 2020 at 6:09 PM	You’re right, jcoyle. Just did a reality check by listening to Mas Alla and Praise a few times on repeat. Wow -- the three minute mark on Praise where Pedro’s soaring voice hands it over to Pat’s synth solo. Otherworldly. Pat had incredible talent in the vocal chair over the years.
jcoyle231 May 07 2020 at 11:10 AM	I don’t know, fw, as great as Nana was you have Pedro on “First Circle” and “Más m Allá”, that still can bring tears and raise the hair on your neck and arms. Pedro’s voice was just transcendent.
facing west Apr 30 2020 at 5:10 PM	It seems almost impossible. But could the Nana V. era PMG be even better than the Pedro era PMG? The live version of As Falls Wichita on Travels is just stunning.
ranhiu Apr 22 2020 at 11:48 PM	Thanks, you can program those two songs on the Travels cd and tell it was played together. This was back in the day when Pat and the group would work out new songs before they were put on their albums. I remembered hearing FIrst Circle that summer before the album came out.
jcoyle231 Apr 22 2020 at 3:13 PM	Thanks for that feedback, ranhiu. What a perfect pairing! I only wish I could have heard it live. The Travels” recording has become one of my favorites of Pat’s and the Group. Sadly, this tour came before my Metheny awakening, just a year later.
ranhiu Apr 20 2020 at 11:39 PM	When the Group played it live back in the day, Farmer’s Trust was played first and then they segued into Goodbye. It was nice to hear them played together as a medley.
jcoyle231 Apr 13 2020 at 8:42 PM	One of my favorites, too, facing west. Very often with Pat you get the whole trajectory of an entire story, beginning, middle, and end. He’s a master storyteller.
facing west Mar 31 2020 at 9:29 AM	Listening to ’Goodbye’ again, I was struck by how much Pat’s solo is so integral to the tune that you almost don’t realize it’s a solo until you’re deep into it. Maybe it’s because it has so much narrative glue. From this perspective, it reminds me of another of my favorite solos, So May It Secretly Begin. Particularly the Trio Live version. Not that they’re musically similar, but they both contain so much narrative that they kind of sneak up on you. If that makes sense.
jcoyle231 Mar 28 2020 at 11:29 AM	Hung around in YouTube this morning and found a bunch of Group live videos I hadn’t seen before and two of “Goodbye” that I found don’t compare to the recorded version. Oh, and “Air Guitar”? The only way I know to play!
jcoyle231 Mar 28 2020 at 9:33 AM	Thanks, tilbanup. Following your suggestion I’ve been looking around on YouTube checking out the interpretations. Sorry the one you mentioned is no longer there, but thanks for your efforts. Can’t stop it playing in my head.
naut Mar 27 2020 at 9:13 PM	Naw. I was just pokin’ around and came across it, jcoyle. There’s pretty decent search functions at this site. To me, Pat’s honorary doctorates are more meaningful than the Grammy wins; although he has an admirable, unprecedented accumulation of those zinc alloy statuettes, to me his honors in academia, as well as at downbeat, outshine the glitzy flaunting of the Recording Academy. Pat also warrants abundant praise for his unending touring, and every live show I’ve seen of his over the years.
jcoyle231 Mar 27 2020 at 6:36 AM	Naut, thanks for introducing me to the concepts of “pitch bend” and digital delay. Way over my head, but I think I see how it relates to what he’s doing on “Goodbye.” Did you just remember that conversation? Impressive. With Pat’s high-level technical brilliance and unbelievable musical artistry it’s not hard to understand why he keeps amassing GRAMMY awards and Honorary Doctorates. I mean, what other musician in any area of music gets asked to give a speech on music and the brain at the annual Society of Neuroscience conference? He’s as fascinating to hear talk as he is to hear play. Lucky us.
tilbanup Mar 27 2020 at 12:15 AM	jcoyle;321, I sat up for a couple hours last night trying to find the guy on You Tube playing Goodbye on a Fender Telecaster. No luck, there is a few different arrangements by a few home performers that do a pretty good job of the their own arrangements but nothing like the guy on the Telecaster. If my memory serves me well, the vision of him playing was quite close up. After learning to play the chords I remember thinking at the time I should play and pause to watch his fingering and try and copy his technique. "Too late she cried", "That ship has sailed" I suppose I can "Air Guitar" it. Wada yuh reck’n
jcoyle231 Mar 26 2020 at 3:51 PM	Thanks for the feedback naut and tilbanup. I have some checking out to do. Appreciate it.
tilbanup Mar 26 2020 at 9:43 AM	jcolye231; A few years back I watched in amazement on You Tube, some guy playing the solo to Goodbye on a Fender Telecaster note for note, he had Pat’s sound on that tune perfect. I can’t find that clip any more. I think it was over a Bobby’s Backing Track.
naut Mar 25 2020 at 11:25 AM	I haven’t checked out the passage you refer to, jcoyle, but you might take a look at a Mar 24, 1999, response by Pat in Question and Answer. The subject is Guitar Sound / category Guitars / question submitted by Jazz Online. Pat goes into pretty substantial detail about his rigs, much of it too technical for my pay grade. You might find it enlightening.
jcoyle231 Mar 24 2020 at 9:04 PM	I have a question I’m sure someone can help me with: at various points during Pat’s solo, but especially at 4:23 on "Goodbye" it sounds to me like I’m hearing two guitars. Can anyone explain what’s happening there? Also, I just want to express my gratitude for the Garage. There are only a small handful (maybe four actually) of people who I can share my love of Pat’s music with and I find the Garage a very civil and supportive community. Thanks.
facing west Mar 23 2020 at 4:13 PM	This tune just knocks me out. Nana has such a healing voice. And the Nana-Pat-Nana pattern is stunning. I was surprised to find that it’s an eight minute track--it’s the art of understatement. Which makes it so devastating. Thanks for the thread--it was great to check this one out again.
bsl8081 Mar 23 2020 at 8:27 AM	JW I agree as these were my formidable years with PMG. Funny that Apple Music lists Travels and Offramp as “alternative”. I guess I agree in that those records are an alternative more people should take. TWU listed as “rock”.......my kinda rock!
tilbanup Mar 23 2020 at 3:38 AM	The first time I heard Goodbye back in the early eighties, I just couldn’t fathom out how someone could write, play and improvise a tune like that. This was when I was first introduced to Pat’s music. I was into strumming my guitar to popular tunes. I had some music tuition but not in Jazz theory or the mind bogling theory(for me) that Jazz masters are into. And now after almost 40 years I can play the chords after buying the Song Book a few years ago. There was no way I could work out the chords myself. I particularly love that ethereal ending of the tune, Lyle’s playing gives me a sense of a sprit ascending. I have often though of it as my funeral send off tune, but the title sounds a bit, "you know" Then again most at my funeral wouldn’t know who was playing let alone the title.
tiny_tim Mar 22 2020 at 4:29 PM	Indeed hman01...who else could voice ’Its for You’ other than Nana...and ....Pedro on ’Mas Alla’ (among so many other charts)....two incredibly gifted musicians...
hman01 Mar 22 2020 at 10:41 AM	Nana and Pedro were different vocalists with their own unique sounds. Both brilliant...
jcoyle231 Mar 21 2020 at 11:23 AM	I agree about Pedro, jw. My first live Group show was in Philly during the “First Circle” tour and Pedro’s vocals on that title track made my hair stand up.
naut Mar 21 2020 at 5:44 AM	jw, I didn’t find your correction didactic at all. I appreciated the clarification. I was just being silly with the ’corner’ quip. I hope to see more of your thoughtful commentary. Cheers!
molesoulsandal Mar 20 2020 at 9:38 AM	well naut, remember while you’re in the corner that there are a coupla live things on the utuber of ’goodbye’ with pedro singing - so you’re naut actually mistaken across the board - haha.
jwmusic Mar 20 2020 at 8:52 AM	Greetings NAUT. Please forgive me if I came off as didactic; that certainly wasn’t my intention. When I think of the PMG’s foremost vocalist over their history, it’s definitely Pedro. I was struck by your observation of "Goodbye’s" arc and the contrast of the tune’s somber beginning with the progression of Pat’s ultimately "joyful solo". I’d never thought of the tune’s development this way, and I appreciate that insight. As I alluded previously, I also appreciate the opportunity to contribute to the discussion of a track that isn’t as celebrated as some of the other Metheny standards.
jcoyle231 Mar 20 2020 at 8:37 AM	Thanks for your comments, jwmusic. It always surprised me that I never heard or read anything about “Goodbye” or saw it on anybody’s list of favorite songs so it’s good to know someone else loves it. Pat has always found the best vocalists and Nana was haunting on this track.
naut Mar 19 2020 at 5:29 PM	Thanks for correcting me on my Pedro/Nana mistake, jw. I’ll go stand in the corner now....
jwmusic Mar 18 2020 at 9:17 PM	I don’t have any insightful information about this great performance from one of the very best PMG albums, but it thrilled me so much to read about this "under-appreciated" track in the vast Metheny canon, I just had to contribute to this thread. I agree that Pat’s solo on "Goodbye" stands out as one his very best; His emotion just flows and pours. I think that the lineup with Vasconcelos, Gottlieb, and Rodby was the best configuration of PMG, which also produced what I feel is the best PMG album, Offramp, (tied with the 1978 eponymous PMG album). If you’re a fan of the As Falls Wichita.../Offramp/Travels period of PMG, there is also a bootleg entitled Salt Lake City which captures another set of brilliant performances by this version of the band. Just an observation: The vocalist on "Goodbye" is Nana Vasconcelos, not Pedro Aznar.
naut Mar 04 2020 at 6:01 PM	It’s amazing how Pat takes what begins as a fairly pensive song with Pedro singing and elevates it with a joyful solo. It’s one of those metamorphoses that Pat does as well as or better than anyone else. Beautiful tune for sure, jcoyle.
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jcoyle231
Jun 11 2020
at 12:54 PM

Thanks, Michel. Have listened to other live versions of “Goodbye”, but the ‘Travels’ version is by far the best in my opinion, just as AYGWM on the same record is the best I’ve heard.

michelforest
Jun 04 2020
at 10:50 PM

"Goodbye" was played around 1985-86, I have a few live recordings of it with Pedro Aznar and one with David Blamires on vocals.

facing west
May 10 2020
at 6:09 PM

You’re right, jcoyle. Just did a reality check by listening to Mas Alla and Praise a few times on repeat. Wow -- the three minute mark on Praise where Pedro’s soaring voice hands it over to Pat’s synth solo. Otherworldly. Pat had incredible talent in the vocal chair over the years.

jcoyle231
May 07 2020
at 11:10 AM

I don’t know, fw, as great as Nana was you have Pedro on “First Circle” and “Más m Allá”, that still can bring tears and raise the hair on your neck and arms. Pedro’s voice was just transcendent.

facing west
Apr 30 2020
at 5:10 PM

It seems almost impossible. But could the Nana V. era PMG be even better than the Pedro era PMG? The live version of As Falls Wichita on Travels is just stunning.

ranhiu
Apr 22 2020
at 11:48 PM

Thanks, you can program those two songs on the Travels cd and tell it was played together. This was back in the day when Pat and the group would work out new songs before they were put on their albums. I remembered hearing FIrst Circle that summer before the album came out.

jcoyle231
Apr 22 2020
at 3:13 PM

Thanks for that feedback, ranhiu. What a perfect pairing! I only wish I could have heard it live. The Travels” recording has become one of my favorites of Pat’s and the Group. Sadly, this tour came before my Metheny awakening, just a year later.

ranhiu
Apr 20 2020
at 11:39 PM

When the Group played it live back in the day, Farmer’s Trust was played first and then they segued into Goodbye. It was nice to hear them played together as a medley.

jcoyle231
Apr 13 2020
at 8:42 PM

One of my favorites, too, facing west. Very often with Pat you get the whole trajectory of an entire story, beginning, middle, and end. He’s a master storyteller.

facing west
Mar 31 2020
at 9:29 AM

Listening to ’Goodbye’ again, I was struck by how much Pat’s solo is so integral to the tune that you almost don’t realize it’s a solo until you’re deep into it. Maybe it’s because it has so much narrative glue. From this perspective, it reminds me of another of my favorite solos, So May It Secretly Begin. Particularly the Trio Live version. Not that they’re musically similar, but they both contain so much narrative that they kind of sneak up on you. If that makes sense.

jcoyle231
Mar 28 2020
at 11:29 AM

Hung around in YouTube this morning and found a bunch of Group live videos I hadn’t seen before and two of “Goodbye” that I found don’t compare to the recorded version. Oh, and “Air Guitar”? The only way I know to play!

jcoyle231
Mar 28 2020
at 9:33 AM

Thanks, tilbanup. Following your suggestion I’ve been looking around on YouTube checking out the interpretations. Sorry the one you mentioned is no longer there, but thanks for your efforts. Can’t stop it playing in my head.

naut
Mar 27 2020
at 9:13 PM

Naw. I was just pokin’ around and came across it, jcoyle. There’s pretty decent search functions at this site. To me, Pat’s honorary doctorates are more meaningful than the Grammy wins; although he has an admirable, unprecedented accumulation of those zinc alloy statuettes, to me his honors in academia, as well as at downbeat, outshine the glitzy flaunting of the Recording Academy. Pat also warrants abundant praise for his unending touring, and every live show I’ve seen of his over the years.

jcoyle231
Mar 27 2020
at 6:36 AM

Naut, thanks for introducing me to the concepts of “pitch bend” and digital delay. Way over my head, but I think I see how it relates to what he’s doing on “Goodbye.” Did you just remember that conversation? Impressive. With Pat’s high-level technical brilliance and unbelievable musical artistry it’s not hard to understand why he keeps amassing GRAMMY awards and Honorary Doctorates. I mean, what other musician in any area of music gets asked to give a speech on music and the brain at the annual Society of Neuroscience conference? He’s as fascinating to hear talk as he is to hear play. Lucky us.

tilbanup
Mar 27 2020
at 12:15 AM

jcoyle;321, I sat up for a couple hours last night trying to find the guy on You Tube playing Goodbye on a Fender Telecaster. No luck, there is a few different arrangements by a few home performers that do a pretty good job of the their own arrangements but nothing like the guy on the Telecaster. If my memory serves me well, the vision of him playing was quite close up. After learning to play the chords I remember thinking at the time I should play and pause to watch his fingering and try and copy his technique. "Too late she cried", "That ship has sailed" I suppose I can "Air Guitar" it. Wada yuh reck’n

jcoyle231
Mar 26 2020
at 3:51 PM

Thanks for the feedback naut and tilbanup. I have some checking out to do. Appreciate it.

tilbanup
Mar 26 2020
at 9:43 AM

jcolye231; A few years back I watched in amazement on You Tube, some guy playing the solo to Goodbye on a Fender Telecaster note for note, he had Pat’s sound on that tune perfect. I can’t find that clip any more. I think it was over a Bobby’s Backing Track.

naut
Mar 25 2020
at 11:25 AM

I haven’t checked out the passage you refer to, jcoyle, but you might take a look at a Mar 24, 1999, response by Pat in Question and Answer. The subject is Guitar Sound / category Guitars / question submitted by Jazz Online. Pat goes into pretty substantial detail about his rigs, much of it too technical for my pay grade. You might find it enlightening.

jcoyle231
Mar 24 2020
at 9:04 PM

I have a question I’m sure someone can help me with: at various points during Pat’s solo, but especially at 4:23 on "Goodbye" it sounds to me like I’m hearing two guitars. Can anyone explain what’s happening there? Also, I just want to express my gratitude for the Garage. There are only a small handful (maybe four actually) of people who I can share my love of Pat’s music with and I find the Garage a very civil and supportive community. Thanks.

facing west
Mar 23 2020
at 4:13 PM

This tune just knocks me out. Nana has such a healing voice. And the Nana-Pat-Nana pattern is stunning. I was surprised to find that it’s an eight minute track--it’s the art of understatement. Which makes it so devastating. Thanks for the thread--it was great to check this one out again.

bsl8081
Mar 23 2020
at 8:27 AM

JW I agree as these were my formidable years with PMG. Funny that Apple Music lists Travels and Offramp as “alternative”. I guess I agree in that those records are an alternative more people should take. TWU listed as “rock”.......my kinda rock!

tilbanup
Mar 23 2020
at 3:38 AM

The first time I heard Goodbye back in the early eighties, I just couldn’t fathom out how someone could write, play and improvise a tune like that. This was when I was first introduced to Pat’s music. I was into strumming my guitar to popular tunes. I had some music tuition but not in Jazz theory or the mind bogling theory(for me) that Jazz masters are into. And now after almost 40 years I can play the chords after buying the Song Book a few years ago. There was no way I could work out the chords myself. I particularly love that ethereal ending of the tune, Lyle’s playing gives me a sense of a sprit ascending. I have often though of it as my funeral send off tune, but the title sounds a bit, "you know" Then again most at my funeral wouldn’t know who was playing let alone the title.

tiny_tim
Mar 22 2020
at 4:29 PM

Indeed hman01...who else could voice ’Its for You’ other than Nana...and ....Pedro on ’Mas Alla’ (among so many other charts)....two incredibly gifted musicians...

hman01
Mar 22 2020
at 10:41 AM

Nana and Pedro were different vocalists with their own unique sounds. Both brilliant...

jcoyle231
Mar 21 2020
at 11:23 AM

I agree about Pedro, jw. My first live Group show was in Philly during the “First Circle” tour and Pedro’s vocals on that title track made my hair stand up.

naut
Mar 21 2020
at 5:44 AM

jw, I didn’t find your correction didactic at all. I appreciated the clarification. I was just being silly with the ’corner’ quip. I hope to see more of your thoughtful commentary. Cheers!

molesoulsandal
Mar 20 2020
at 9:38 AM

well naut, remember while you’re in the corner that there are a coupla live things on the utuber of ’goodbye’ with pedro singing - so you’re naut actually mistaken across the board - haha.

jwmusic
Mar 20 2020
at 8:52 AM

Greetings NAUT. Please forgive me if I came off as didactic; that certainly wasn’t my intention. When I think of the PMG’s foremost vocalist over their history, it’s definitely Pedro. I was struck by your observation of "Goodbye’s" arc and the contrast of the tune’s somber beginning with the progression of Pat’s ultimately "joyful solo". I’d never thought of the tune’s development this way, and I appreciate that insight. As I alluded previously, I also appreciate the opportunity to contribute to the discussion of a track that isn’t as celebrated as some of the other Metheny standards.

jcoyle231
Mar 20 2020
at 8:37 AM

Thanks for your comments, jwmusic. It always surprised me that I never heard or read anything about “Goodbye” or saw it on anybody’s list of favorite songs so it’s good to know someone else loves it. Pat has always found the best vocalists and Nana was haunting on this track.

naut
Mar 19 2020
at 5:29 PM

Thanks for correcting me on my Pedro/Nana mistake, jw. I’ll go stand in the corner now....

jwmusic
Mar 18 2020
at 9:17 PM

I don’t have any insightful information about this great performance from one of the very best PMG albums, but it thrilled me so much to read about this "under-appreciated" track in the vast Metheny canon, I just had to contribute to this thread. I agree that Pat’s solo on "Goodbye" stands out as one his very best; His emotion just flows and pours. I think that the lineup with Vasconcelos, Gottlieb, and Rodby was the best configuration of PMG, which also produced what I feel is the best PMG album, Offramp, (tied with the 1978 eponymous PMG album). If you’re a fan of the As Falls Wichita.../Offramp/Travels period of PMG, there is also a bootleg entitled Salt Lake City which captures another set of brilliant performances by this version of the band. Just an observation: The vocalist on "Goodbye" is Nana Vasconcelos, not Pedro Aznar.

naut
Mar 04 2020
at 6:01 PM

It’s amazing how Pat takes what begins as a fairly pensive song with Pedro singing and elevates it with a joyful solo. It’s one of those metamorphoses that Pat does as well as or better than anyone else. Beautiful tune for sure, jcoyle.

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