Bookmark and Share

Community (American Garage)

Subject View

SUBJECT: Appreciation of quality jazz Back to Subjects
patsfan
Apr 12 2011
at 12:10 AM
After reading the demographics on this site, it comfirms somewhat my general experience. The fans here are special. First of all, i feel a majority of people are clueless about music. Like junkfood, inferior music permeates the population. Appreciation of Pat Metheny and other exceptional jazz musicians is rare among those i encounter.What are your opinions on this?
Login to Post
From: Message:
patsfan
Apr 25 2011
at 11:35 PM
Bookmark and Share Well, TWU has been playing in my car for the past week. It’s not background music, believe me. In fact, in the confines of the car, I am really able to appreciate music.... and loud.
dsahadi
Apr 24 2011
at 8:23 PM
Bookmark and Share We have an NPR station here in Phoenix that plays Jazz (KJJZ). It is well intended but I rarely listen to it. Not because I don’t appreciate the fact it is there......but it plays traditional Jazz (the greats...Miles, Trane, Hawkins, Jazz vocalists, as one of the DJs is vocalist) but the same stuff gets played over and over. I called the DJ about this and she her main goal was to introduce and educate listeners to Jazz. I think she starts 60percent of the shows with either So What or All Blues. With no disrespect intended, it turns turns that mucic into "Top 40". I can only hope that Blaze Lantana continues introduce more people to Jazz, but I can’t listen to Jazz radio here in the valley. KCSM in the Bay Area really has the right mix of old and new material the peaks interest. As a player I have pretty defined tastes about what I listen. What is interesting is that it varies greatly from what I play.
thirdwind
Apr 24 2011
at 4:58 PM
Bookmark and Share Foper said, "I can never have Pat’s music on as just background music. Sometimes people put it on and they’re yip yapping away and all I want to do is tell them to shut up and listen." That’s a strong statement that explains a lot. Many’s the time I think of listening to PMG and think, "No, I don’t quite have the energy to bring to it just now." Listening to SS or TWU is an event, a gig, that will claim an hour or more. I don’t listen to it while driving to the grocery: the visuals would be too mundane. Long ago, we of Pat’s generation were fond of gathering in dim basements to audition the latest album from The Moody Blues, Zappa or Hendrix. The Beatles’ White Album, honest to God, was about as big a deal as Harry Potter! Now, with music everywhere, our attention is spread too thin. I know quite a few folks who know of PM, and listened way, way back when, but haven’t kept up with anything he’s done in the 21st century (to be fair, those odd, edgy albums like Song X and Sign of 4 may have thrown some of them off track). Denver is blessed with a jazz FM station, but they rarely play Pat. They prefer straight-shead stuff, classic and modern, some of it quite good... good enough to turn on background music, anyway.
MarcNebo
Apr 22 2011
at 8:52 AM
Bookmark and Share In 2010 I saw thirty six different bands and this year will probably see over sixty. Every show has been worth my investment. Every Jazz musician I have talked to after the show or between sets has been very appreciative and nice to me. They have thanked me for attended the show and for buying their cd.
HAMBONE
Apr 21 2011
at 11:49 AM
Bookmark and Share Agreed MarcNebo. That’s why we real jazz fans have to support the music,not just listen to it. It’s up to us to help keep the music alive for the future jazz fans to enjoy. Sometimes when I am attending a jazz show I think I may be spending more money than I should and could be using it for something else. But then I’ll see a show by a local high school jazz band and I know it’s all worth it.
bluepno
Apr 21 2011
at 10:50 AM
Bookmark and Share Hi Marc..it is an excellent lesson in marketing and distribution of a disposable product.
MarcNebo
Apr 21 2011
at 10:31 AM
Bookmark and Share "American Idol" or "America Idle", as I call it is case in point. What the masses thinks is great music seldom is. I hate seeing AI winners make millions of dollars while truly talented musicians struggle to make much less.
DCTWMT
Apr 21 2011
at 8:41 AM
Bookmark and Share To sum up: Most people wouldn’t know good music if it came up and bit them in the ass. (Frank Zappa)
mugsy
Apr 20 2011
at 6:57 PM
Bookmark and Share Yes, Hambone, that is exactly what i am referring to. I come across people from time to time who will have something going in the background and I will ask who it is and what CD is it, or something along those lines. Half the time, the person playing it - doesn’t even know who is on the CD! Never- mind, really listening to it with a critical ear. I do my best listening when I am home alone, with headphones on and especially when I am not distracted by any other needs (to do list, etc.). I do also "hear" music in my car, and while walking - but the listening comes when the music has got my attention and I settle down to really get into it.
HAMBONE
Apr 20 2011
at 11:41 AM
Bookmark and Share I agree totally patsfan. And to take it one step further, with most, if not all, of us here being jazz fans and not just Pat Metheny fans, we are music listeners. Because to really appreciate jazz and the level of musicianship it entails,you do have to listen and not just hear it. And that’s why I think some people just don’t "get it" when the try to listen to jazz, because they can only hear it.
foper
Apr 20 2011
at 10:43 AM
Bookmark and Share Mugsy… Having grown up in a home filled with music and musicians I not only listen with an analytical ear, but also an emotional one. I think I have almost every part of ‘First Circle’ memorized in my head and can sing any specific part. Even though I have listened to it 1000s of times that song still gets me to tears. I can never have Pat’s music on as just background music. Sometimes people put it on and they’re yip yapping away and all I want to do is tell them to shut up and listen. LOL. Saint Saens’ ‘Symphony #3’ has the same effect on me. But there is still some Pat music I just can’t get into no matter how many times I listen to it.
patsfan
Apr 20 2011
at 1:21 AM
Bookmark and Share Yes, Mugsy,and it tends to be very passive when they ’hear’ music. They have no opinion about it, don’t listen to the quality of the notes, and could care less about talking about it. That’s the majority that i run into. When i go to someone’s house, i’ll ask what’s playing, even if i don’t like the music. When i listen to music, i appreciate the fact that the first listen isn’t always the best test. I still like to have an opinion on what i hear, and at least give it chance. A majority could care less,and if they play music,they only ’hear’ it.
mugsy
Apr 19 2011
at 1:03 PM
Bookmark and Share I think that what "patsfan" may be getting at is that there is a huge difference between "listening" to music and "hearing" music. I venture to say that the majority of the people I know "hear" music but don’t take the time to "listen" to it. Case in point is this: how many times on this website (which is obviously full of special "listeners") is there a thread about a new CD in which many of us talk about how the music has grown on us over time. I have a friend who on first listen - hated Imaginary Day! After a couple of listens, he now says he likes it a lot. Pat’s music is really unique and special. It sometimes takes time to really get it - by listening attentively. There are so many nuances that you cannot get on one listen.
patsfan
Apr 19 2011
at 12:12 AM
Bookmark and Share Yes, Barley, it absolutely boggles my mind !
barley
Apr 16 2011
at 11:30 AM
Bookmark and Share Love it, a bog thumbs up PeeWee.
patsfan
Apr 15 2011
at 11:21 PM
Bookmark and Share Hey , give PeeWee a bog thumbs up for a very rational analysis of human nature and appreciation of creativity !!!
Oystein
Apr 15 2011
at 7:45 AM
Bookmark and Share Dazed and Foper said it all. I rest my case.
PeeWee
Apr 15 2011
at 7:00 AM
Bookmark and Share True appreciation of excellent music is directly proportional to the degree to which reason and independent thinking manifests itself in one’s life or, inversely proportional to one’s adherence to conformity and a lack of imagination :)
patsfan
Apr 14 2011
at 11:12 PM
Bookmark and Share Foper.....absolutely you took the words out of my mouth! Great post! I love the TWU analogy (by the way, I love that album more with time). Yes, our culture has been reduced to bytes of info, and it’s like swimming up a river current of garbage. I and my wife swore off TV and are happier for it Yeh, we probably miss some good stuff. Like tonight, I’m listening to Wasilewski’s Faithful , reading and sipping some great wine. I need nothing else. I feel sorry for the masses who watch and listen to all the crappy soundbites on TV.
Dazedcat
Apr 14 2011
at 3:06 PM
Bookmark and Share Nice post Foper. Barly I’ll investigate the person you mentioned, thanks for the name.
foper
Apr 14 2011
at 7:31 AM
Bookmark and Share LOL at Patsfan… I think you’re too new to know what the record for postings might be in a 24 hour period. Going back to the days of the ‘Basement’, it was a whirlwind. We’re not even touching the tip here. But your point was understood; but what I think you’re missing is my comments stem from Pat’s comments when he released “TWU”. He talked about how that recording was a protest against how our society has reduced our dialogue to little snippets. Our attention span is not much longer than about 2 minutes. He elaborated about the political environment and such as well, but his larger message was how we demand quick, short, meaningless answers; our media gives us the bare minimum because we can’t focus long enough to actually dig into all the facts and get truly educated. This bleeds over into music. Our music has been reduced to simplistic repetitive beats, vulgarity, single-layered melodies/harmonies, and very little artistic thought. This is driven by an audience that has very little desire to think beyond the next 4-letter word. Folks that listen to Pat (and those like him) seem to have a deeper thinking towards most things: music, current events, social studies, etc… We can hear depth in the complexities of ‘First Circle’. We go beyond just swallowing the fragments of news we are fed from Fox, CNN, and MSNBC and demand more information before accepting the conventional garbage shoveled out of those outlets. We can sit for an hour and not just listen to ‘TWU’, but also analyze it bit by bit, layer by layer. Most folks don’t have such a capacity. In the most simplistic explanation, I blame the remote control. It’s a metaphor for the creation that made us a lazy society.
zargb5
Apr 14 2011
at 7:06 AM
Bookmark and Share classical music in the UK at least used to get saturday night tv slots (remember andre previn’s shows at prime time? Jazz used to get a good look in on the BBC with oscar peterson’s show which often featured current jazz artists and even rock stars and interviews. Other than BBC radio 3 jazz input TV now is something of a desert landscape for quality music. Even satellite channels don’t much cover jazz but classical gets more of a look in on sky arts (Bartok, Beethoven and often the usual suspects)Channel 4 used to feature british conductor simon rattle for a couple of series featuring live music or documentary style programmes. The current crop of execs are ’spiritually or culturally bankrupt’ WE have hundreds of TV stations and Radio stations and its mostly full of junk (70’s 80’s 90’s pop nostalgia) classic fm which has millions of listeners never really pushes the listeners boundaries beyond slow movements and the basic popular core repertoire. It’s like the old Bruce Springsteen song ’57 channels and nothing on’
patsfan
Apr 14 2011
at 12:28 AM
Bookmark and Share First of all, I’m amazed that Barley, Dazedcat and Foper can post so many interactive comments in 24 hours. A new record on PM site! Secondly, I feel I didn’t ’t phrase my subject totally accurately. If someone is avid about hip hop, or opera, I respect them. Problem is, most people are just vaguely clueless about music and won’t even listen or exhibit curiosity. For me, I’m one or the other. Most opera to me is sonically unpleasant. Some hip hop is curiously cool. Some blues music is great, but a lot of it sucks. Most people could care less, and, approach music with little or no enthusiasm. Or, that’s my experience.
bluepno
Apr 13 2011
at 6:21 PM
Bookmark and Share I’m with -m, pop fodder should be fun or...remember the off button. All work and no play makes jack a dull boy. If Mozart can do a theme an variations on Twinkle, twinkle little star then gaga can light the piano on fire. I’ll take jimi’s version tho.
barley
Apr 13 2011
at 12:37 PM
Bookmark and Share Dazedcat, may I recommend to you (and others) the wonderful Mr. Clive James, Australian novelist/poet/jazz lover. Sure he’s an old Australian fogey, but a remarkable breath of fresh, cultural air. His memoirs (of which there are 5 volumes) make me laugh and cry, sometimes simultaneously.
foper
Apr 13 2011
at 12:36 PM
Bookmark and Share Dazed... It wasn’t when the remote control was invented. Everything has a starting point.
HAMBONE
Apr 13 2011
at 11:47 AM
Bookmark and Share I think the deomographics can be viewed several ways. One shows us that there is an age factor to Pat’s fans that is close to his age, which is to be expected. But it also shows there needs to be a "passing of the torch" to the next generation so the truly important things in life, like the arts and interactive activities ,are not forgotten.And I blame the mouse as much as the remote.
Dazedcat
Apr 13 2011
at 10:36 AM
Bookmark and Share Sorry Foper but it’s way way deeper than the remote control.
-m
Apr 13 2011
at 9:00 AM
Bookmark and Share Yes its true there is a lot of junk out there. I consume some myself on occasion. On the other hand we have Pat, we had EST, and we have Esperanza Spaulding and her Grammy. No junk in that lot. For every MacFood spot we have superb restaurants vying for top spot in their own world and some of us have a local dive where the waitress will tell you she’s been there ‘nigh on 40 years now…’ – at mine the food is fantastic and wonderfully greasy. We have youngsters coming up who eschew the latest from Princess GooGoo and her staff of studio musicians in favor of going out and starting a garage band and trying to break into the local bar scene. I know some of them myself and they’re pretty damn impressive in an aggressive post Who kind of way. So yes there is a lot of junk out there but if you don’t like it change the channel, I’m sure there’s a remote control nearby. ;)
foper
Apr 13 2011
at 5:33 AM
Bookmark and Share Dazed... I blame the remote control.
barley
Apr 13 2011
at 2:51 AM
Bookmark and Share Long overdue.
Dazedcat
Apr 12 2011
at 9:05 PM
Bookmark and Share Barley:Grab a pitchfork (after drinks of course) and storm the Bastille with me then. It’s time, don’t you think?
barley
Apr 12 2011
at 3:47 PM
Bookmark and Share Dazedcat, once again you’ve said it all in a sentence. I wish I could buy you a drink in real life!!
Dazedcat
Apr 12 2011
at 2:56 PM
Bookmark and Share Everything today is junk food. A junk bankrupt culture generates tons of junk, music included. I blame the Corporate Mother whose appetite can never be satisfied. The bottom line and the resulting bonus is all that matters. Music, art, culture and life are just needless expenses.
Login to Post